Question:
Hopefully this will clear things up!
uturn2001 askes how he got this dream job. The big guys wouldn't hire him. This job was listed in the paper and he took it. He was warned about the "mom & pop" companies. But a job is a job - besides the experience would be helpful. I don't think it ever dawned on him about drivers leaving the company in the last couple of weeks.
coolbreeze - I have no problems giving the name of the company but would like to wait until he's recieved his checks.
Little Red - For 4 of his weeks of driving, he had prior commitments (CS Court). The company knew this and it was not a problem. Then for the other weeks, it was running hard. 4-5 10hour days in a row. That is how he got over hours.
Beeman - You are correct I think about the lack of communication part. I never interfered with the runs/loads. But try to figure this out according to dispatch it should take only 8 hours to drive 600 miles through the Ohio Valley. This is why driver was late most of the time because dispatch would give him incorrect mileage, hours or drop off times. Or refuse to follow the 70 hour rule.
Shuffler - You should really pay closer attention to what your reading. The Owner fired him on 2-25 because he would not violate his log book. Then on 2-26 the owner got him a load to pick up on 2-26 therefore rehiring him. But then on 2-27 dispatch said to have the truck at terminal by Monday morning. (trailer has 2 different loads on it - about 500 miles apart). Owner then calls driver Saturday to say have the truck returned on Saturday or he would call it in as stollen.
RoadHugger - Do Not Pin This On Me
Because my husband is new and I will be also I posted questions to the board. I thought thats what this board was all about.

Answer:
Thanks for filling-in some of the details. It's better when they're not spread-out on multiple posts/threads.
Most drivers don't have enough time to phone a question home, have their life partner post it on a trucking site, then wait for the answer before making a decision.
The driver's presentd with a choice (the job is, after all, just making one decision after another) and is expected to make that decision themselves, and get going. There's usually no time to research a second opinion.
For a mom and pop business, this sounds pretty typical. They're weren't sure what they wanted to do with him -- a clear invitation to turn in the truck accompanied by another assignment -- standard stuff. "Run this load, or return the truck." What else are they supposed to do? If he isn't going to play ball, move over and let someone else get in the seat. Sounds pretty clear to me.
The logs issue is sort of a red herring. They obviously want him to fudge and time-shift. If he doesn't want to do this, he should quit. Sounds like they've make it clear this is NOT a negotiable isue, so what's the problem. How much advise does he need to just return the truck and resign or take their termination. What's he trying to do? Change the way they expect their drivers to log time and move freight? LOL
You say they fired him on 2/25? That's FIVE DAYS AGO! And he still has the truck? No wonder they're threatning legal action.
Again -- although no one else here has picked up on it, and you still haven't said if the truck's still loaded -- if the trailer IS empty or he's BOBTAILING, he can log the truck's return on line-1. Just flag "relieved of duty" and drive the dam thing back on his own personal time.
If he isn't under a load, and
If he isn't deadheading or positioning the truck for HIS next load on HIS log book,
...then he does not have to log it on line-3 anyway. Same thing if he's home and wants to drive it to the store. He's been relieved of any "duty" and can log it that way on line-1 if the truck is empty.
Once and for all, could you PLEASE answer the question:
Is the truck empty? ...so we an put this logging issue to bed?
If it IS empty, why didn't he have it back 4 days ago? Geeez....four days ago. Even if he thought he had to log it, surely he's picked-up enough hours by now.
"... coolbreeze - I have no problems giving the name of the company but would like to wait until he's recieved his checks... "
Received his checks? Are you kidding. Holding the truck has cost the company more in revenue than they probably owe him. LOL. He ain't gettin' a dime, I would guess. Sorry, but that's how these things usually turn out -- and that's one of the reasons why we've been saying RETURN THE TRUCK IMMEDIATELY.
Nothing personal -- just trying to help. I think you got the good advise you came here for. What else can we do but tell you lke it is?
(disfunctional co-dependents there's nothing much you can do, they live for this drama)
[This message was edited by Shuffler on March 02, 2003 at 13:55.]

Answer:
One more time:
PLEASE FOLLOW THE STEPS!
1. Out of hours - told to return truck by Monday morning (that means terminated)
2. Loaded trailer for company (2 deliveries on trailer) If deliveries aren't made he's just refused work
3. Company now tells him to deliver truck to teminal by Saturday night. If trucks not delivered he's just stole it.
The truck was delivered last night. Fully loaded. Now owner has truck and also has load that he didn't want delivered.
There is no reason for him not to get paid. Nothing was damaged or destroyed.

Answer:
Well, the "steps" keep changing. But according to this latest version, the answers are:
1.
Return the truck to the terminal by monday morning. "By" means as close to 23:59 on Sunday as possible. What EVER time or day they tell him, he calls them, gives them a realistic asap eta and returns the truck by that time.
2.
Accepts the new load asignment and gets to work on it, humbly putting this unfortunate incident behind him and trying to work with these folks in good faith.
I'd pick #1. It's his choice.
As far as pay goes, the company MAY consider the truck's daily revenue potential as a "thing" your husband has, indeed, "damaged" -- or at least, that's what they'll claim. It's a "cost" they may deduct from his paycheck. It may be unethical sometimes, but that's what they do, and they usually get away with it, especially when retrieving abandoned equipment. They deduct the cost and lost rvenue from the driver's last pay check/settlemnt check.
They can get around almost any "circumstances" the driver can come up with, since he's already agreed to this, in writing, when he hired on.
jeeeeezzzz... I give up... that's it for me on this one.
.
[This message was edited by Shuffler on March 02, 2003 at 14:41.]

Answer:
LOL Basicly this is the way the company has worked all along. They tell you one thing then do another.
Your fired - no your hired - no your fired again.
No not the company to work for.
He's ready to have company ask him when he's ready to run anothert load.
Funny when he dropped off the truck last night, all the company trucks were there.

Answer:
Yes this is "WHAT THIS BOARD" is all about and I posted a CASE SENARIO showing that it is not always the COMPANIES FAULT.
Maybe you did not like what my posted implied and at the same time maybe it hit a bit closer to home than you liked.
And do not condemn the MOM & POP operations as many are the best anyone could ask to work for.
You do not need 4000+ trucks to be a good employer nor do you only need 1 to be a bad employer.

Answer:
Correct me if I am wrong here Tabi, but I think this is the basic scenario here.
1.Driver gets CDL...cant find work for some reason with a training company and goes to work for this mom and pop outfit who basically hand him the keys and say go.
2. While driver was in school he was told to "not make waves" for the first year or so which he took to mean that he does what he is told and to keep his mouth shut period. He was also told in school to log it like he runs it.
3. Driver accepts loads that were illegal dispatches from the get go and company thinks ..."Oh boy. Here we got us a winner. We will keep him moving since this guy dont know no better." and since driver is logging it like he runs it he is out of hours. (More than likely logging full dock time and this is where the big problem between company and driver came in at. )
4. Driver hears about all the fines and trouble he can get into for violating HOS rules, and may just be plain worn out too. Finally driver puts foot down (while having 80+ hours of work time on log) and says "I am out of hours. I cant and wont move until nmy log book says I can." Which is Saturday morning, two day off. Company gets pissed and says fine you are fired".
5. Driver given load to get him home (to turn truck in) that has two stops. One Monday morning one monday night. He figures he has to deliver these before turning truck in beasue he has been told before by company to deliver all loads as dispatched or he will get fined by company (which has happened once or twice). Then company tells him to turn truck in "NOW" and driver is confused as to what to do and a little worried about getting fined if he doesnt deliver load but also worried if he does deliver the load he is going to be arrested for theft. Feels he is in a catch 22.
6. Driver is confused as hell as what to do through all this and talks to wife and tells her so. She says she will try to find some help since the company sure isnt offering any.
7. Over the course of several days wife posts several different questions on several issues relating to all of this and trying to clear up some more of the confusion husband is having due to the truck stop know-it-alls.
Whatcha think. Pretty much sum it up.
Only two things I know of are infinite. The universe and human stupidity, and I am not real sure about the universe.
Answer:
--------------------------------------------------
Little Red - For 4 of his weeks of driving, he had prior commitments (CS Court). The company knew this and it was not a problem. Then for the other weeks, it was running hard. 4-5 10hour days in a row. That is how he got over hours
--------------------------------------------------
I still stand by my previous post. He needs to learn how to manage his time. All of his phone calls home is logged off duty not on duty.
That still only averages to 2500 miles a week
at most he should only be out of hours is one day and he should have already turned the truck in.
I still think there is alot that has not been said. But now I am courious why no other company would hire him..Maybe to many court dates.
I also don't believe that it is because it is a small MOM and POP company..They did give him a chance when no one else would.
He or maybe you just can't handle the life of a trucker.
Most drivers drive 10 hours 6-7 days a week not just 4-5. And they do not run out of hours where they must take 4 days off

Answer:
That is Exactly how I had it summed up as well.
Little Red, You hit the nail on the head.

Answer:
If I have to bet I would lay odds he was running out of hours on the dock. In a past post Tabi had said something to the effect that his loads were often multi stoppers which were almost always driver unloads. In addition to this she also said that he was hauling live plants and many times it took he several hours per stop to unload the merchandise for that stop. The company on the other hand was probably figuring 15 min per stop log time while he was logging actual time. Plus I bet he was logging real drive time instead of averaging which the company was doing on its dispatches. In other words he was logging 100% legal. Which will make you run out of hours in a hurry.
I am basing this on some of the "clues" left in other posts since I have no more info than anyone else. In some of those other posts there were thing said like
He is wanting to go with a trainer with his next company since he had no training.
Some of his stops took him 3 or 4 hours to do.
He is hauling live flowers/plants. (which from exp I know are very time sensitive and also very time consuming at thedock)
There were several exp drivers that had quit after only a week or two. (Which tells me this company may be overly demanding on how they want things done and rules and regs be damned. )
Anyway this is some of what I have gotten from piecing together this and that and reading in between the lines a little.
Maybe it might help make the picture a little clearer if you (generic you meaning those wo dont understand it) stepped back a little and look at it from the perspective of just being out of school and not having any training what so ever to see where this driver ran into trouble as far as his log book and the company. After all most schools I know of that teach logging teach you to log it as you drive/work it and it isnt until you are out with a trainer that you learn the little "tricks" to help you log it legal and try to keep dispatch happy too.
Only two things I know of are infinite. The universe and human stupidity, and I am not real sure about the universe.
Answer:
Little Red - For 4 of his weeks of driving, he had prior commitments (CS Court). The company knew this and it was not a problem. Then for the other weeks, it was running hard. 4-5 10hour days in a row. That is how he got over hours.
i thought running 10-15 hrs a day was normal trucking. i love auto freight, makes the week go by very quick.
i learned very quickly in the first 2 months that a log book is ********. i run till i'm tired. sleep, then run some more. i dun think i have had
an "8" hour break in 3 1/2 months.
maybe i'm foolish, but i like my paychecks. just my opion, so slam me all ya want.
Death To All Extremist Muslims

Answer:
Is alqways up to date otherwise one of these days some drunk fool is going to pull out in front of you and wham....by by paycheck for the rest of your life cause it is going to the "victim" or his family....and thats when you get out of jail.
Only two things I know of are infinite. The universe and human stupidity, and I am not real sure about the universe.
Answer:
i learned very quickly in the first 2 months that a log book is ********. i run till i'm tired. sleep, then run some more. i dun think i have had
an "8" hour break in 3 1/2 months.
Amen to that, you hit the nail dead on the head.
John Q.
Disclaimer: The views posted are those of the author. The accuracy of the rules posted are subject to the status of rules and regulations posted by the GPO and other Government Agencies. The author accepts no responsibility for inaccuracies of any posted regulation or interpretation. Readers should seek legal counsel for all legal issues."If men were angels...No government would be necessary."
51st Federalist Papers
"Nichols' Fourth Law says, "Avoid any action with an unacceptable outcome"

Answer:
"...i run till i'm tired. sleep, then run some more..."
I bet you could make the same appointment, and do it better rested, if you made a 10/8 schedule and stuck to it.

Answer:
uturn2001
How come you can figure it out and everyone else has a different picture of it.
In anycase, I think the real problem here along with a "not so nice" company is that he had no trainer. Someone mentioned he needs time management skills and the implication of "talking to wife on phone should be logged as off duty time".
He can't drive a full 10 hours non stop due to medication he's on so there is a couple stops just for that.
And we have unlimited use cell phones so he doesn't stand around at a truck stop wasting time.